new rotary

[Steve Gee]

anybody who doesn`t read motorcycle sport and leisure should get down to W H Smith`s and have a look at the article starting on page 115 of the August issue. I`m starting saving now! or is this just another pipe dream :(

[David Brown]

Wow! \rIts not April 1st is it? \rWell spotted by Steve Gee.\rThis should generate some interesting discussions. I wouldn't normally buy this magazine, but very glad I did. \rGreat news for Norton Rotary enthusiasts.\rWhat does everyone else think?\rIs it going to get off the ground?\r\rDavid

[dave perry]

PLEASE, put us out of misery & give some brief details, i'm tearing my hair out !

[Richard Negus]

Anyone know the meaning of 'common sense' :?: \rCommon sense tells you that those who wish and have money go out and do things (John Bloor for example)\rCommon sense tells you that those who wish and don't have money, shout about it in the hope of attracting someone else's money (Philip LeRoux for example).\rCommon sense tells you that saying you'll have bikes in production in eighteen months when you haven't even got a working design is pie in the sky.\rCommon sense tells you a rotary won't meet current European emissions regulations without spending an enormous amount of time & money.\rCommon sense tells you that there aren't 70 enthusiasts in the UK that would buy a 100 bhp "Norton" for £30,000 or more. Garner's advisers aren't quite correct regarding emissions regulations - or they didn't ask the right questions.\rCommon sense tells you that EPA emissions regulations are even more strict than European and that proving costs are even higher.\rCommon sense tells you that experience is priceless.\rExperience tells you that empty cans make the most noise :!: \r\rG O M

[kanonkopdrinker]

I see the story is in MCN today .... a new factory at Donington, eh?\rWill get down to WH Smith tomorrow and see if I can get a copy of M S & L

[whiffling clara]

Not much real comment on the new bikes from Norton Racing. I would have thought this forum would be awash with enthusiastic comment by now. The only real comment is from W588 who is less than enthusiastic to say the least.\rDoes anyone :-\rWant one ?\rThink it will never happen ?\rThink they will cost too much ?\rThink they will be successful ?\rThink the bikes are great ?\rThink W588 is an "old stick in the mud" ?\r\rCome on you lot. Lets support this new venture.\rI'm saving for my deposit.

[Derek Nicol]

I only heard about this today, i was at a 50's Bikes day at Jacks Hill Cafe and a bloke in a Crighton Norton Cap who saw me arive on the Rotary told me about it. Did you know that Brian Crighton has a website?...\rhttp://nortonracing.com/\rAmazing- Brilliant news though i can certainly understand where W588 is coming from, i must admit i did think 'here we go again - wheres the money for something like this coming from', lets hope hes got some really good solid backing.\rWhat the website doesnt seem to mention is, according to the mystery man in the cap (who claims to know Brian Crighton), Brian is aiming to go Moto GP racing!!!... now that would need some really serious money!!\rBest of luck Brian, youve done it once against all the odds - courtesy of your brilliance & ingenuity combined with a certain tobacco companies money, i really hope you can beat the odds again.\rSorry, i wont be placing an order, the bikes are as far out of my reach now as the F1 was in 1990.

[Richard Negus]

according to the mystery man in the cap (who claims to know Brian Crighton), Brian is aiming to go Moto GP racing!!!... \r\rMisquotes rule ! Iknow he means the 250 replacement class, but comments like that make me, and probably several others in the real world, cringe. After all, Moto GP is big business ruled by the major manufacturers who I guess wouldn't look too kindly on a rotary engine joining their party game.\rContrary to 'Whiffling Clara's' suggestion, I'm not a stick in the mud but am old enough to remember other triumphs of optimism over reality (KRM Superstreak, Weslake GP, Sparton, Petronas, Roton even).\rAs I hinted in my first post, don't tell me what you're going to do, go out and do it !\rIf my diesel Bullet lasts that far, I'll see you all at Mallory on Sunday.

[Derek Nicol]

W588 - you know Brian do you not? dont you get any first hand information?

[Steve Gee]

Just back from Mallory, and it was there ! unfortunately i`m no early riser so missed qualifying, but 4th place sounded reasonable for a first time out. However,the circuit announcer told us there were problems and sure enough a visit to the pits revealed a stripped down machine. Race time and announcer says no Norton on the grid, damn another wasted journey. Watching race with diminished interest suddenly spot a mobile smoke screen mid pack ! not sure whether it started from pit lane or back of grid, and commentator was non the wiser, but it was ruddy fast and looking good, unfortunately a coming together with another machine ended the spectacle. Lee Dickinson and the Norton were up to about 10th, not bad from very last, well done and roll on the next race.

[Richard Negus]

W588 - you know Brian do you not? dont you get any first hand information?

\rMaybe you're confusing me with someone else? I haven't talked to Brian about this venture and all my opinions come from experience and from what I read in the comics and various web sites.\rHave a look at the US Norton site, and wonder at the lack of focus there. Allegedly US$6M of investors money spent, two prototypes built and no concept of satisfying emissions and noise regulations. \rTime for another sedative !\rVGOM

[Steve Gee]

Just an update, according to a report on the MCN website the problem at Mallory was electrical, to be precise the rear cooling fan, this resulted in overheating and the bike crashing when it`s own coolant got on the rear tyre. The correspondant was also impressed by the Nortons performance up untill the crash so at least it wasn`t just my rose tinted glasses. I should have added on Sunday that the rider was fine, and little damage done to the bike.

[whiffling clara]

My first post on this subject was intended to raise some comment on this venture but has raised very little.\rI must now admit that I agree with all of W588's comments.\rRoadbikes ready for sale next spring / summer and 200 to be made and all according to the website at a new factory that is not yet built. This is never going to happen in this timescale.\rLike W588 I dont see these bikes passing the relevant emmission regulations to be sold abroad as only Great Britian has the single vehicle regulations. Whilst the NRV 588 doesnt have to pass exhaust emmissions I believe it does have to pass crankcase emmissions and I dont see it doing that with a fan blowing oil laden cooling air out to atmosphere.\rI also believe there are not enough people out there who want one and will pay the surely high asking price - my guess is about £35,000.\rNo - I'm not saving for one. Assuming I had that kind of money to spend on a bike then one of these would not even be on the list.\rI also remember the KRM Supersteak, Sparton, etc. The lack of comment on the Norton Racing website regarding the less than triumphant racing debut of the NRV 588 also reminds me of the dire warnings issed to Doug Hele by the Triumph management after a disasterous practice at Daytona in 1966. Fortunately for Doug, and his future career at Triumph, the 500 twin won the race.\rNRV 588's on the roads in quantity, racers at GP level, racers at National or World Supersport or Superbike level - I dont think so.

[Peterpinkbike]

Although I'm a newbie, I feel moved to write about recent comment on the NRV588. Its a brave attempt to get the Norton name back on the front pages of MCN again. However, look at this week's copy, you'll how Triumph are doing in Supersport this year and they've been in production for several years. Nothing like this is easy, even for the Japanese brands, and I'd love to see Nortons in Moto GP alongside Honda and Ducati but I don't see it happening either.\rI wouldn't want a Honda, can't afford a Desmosedici, and probably won't live long enough to see a new Norton.\rBasket case Commander it is then !\rBy the way, how is the NRV588 called a Norton when Norton is now an American company?\rHN

[wust588]

All this reminds me of another "new Norton" called, if my memory serves me correctly, the NEMESIS.\rThis also reminds me of a comment made to me by someone who had visited the Shenstone factory sometime during the 1990's and seen a huge spiders web, with a note written close to it. It read as follows: Norton's website : www. Norton Nemesis Bo..ocks.com.\rJoking apart, it must be said that Brian deserves great respect for his racing achievements of the 80's and 90's, culminating with the 1992 Steve Hislop race win.\rMy real fear is that it might all end in ignominy.

[Peterpinkbike]

- had absolutely nothing to do with Mr Crighton ! Wasn't he already in Australia racing the Rotons, sponsored by a window cleaner ?\rTo be fair, it has to be said that without his vision, there wouldn't have been any rotary racing, no JPS Nortons, no Rotons, and no Duckhams Nortons.

[Derek Nicol]

[quote="Peterpinkbike]To be fair, it has to be said that without his vision, there wouldn't have been any rotary racing, no JPS Nortons, no Rotons, and no Duckhams Nortons.[/quote]\rExactly! if it were anyone other than Brian Crighton i would bet against it getting off the ground but with Brian at the helm, well, just maybe! Brian understands better than anyone the oil mist problem and no doubt has a solution in mind to capture the oil and recycle it. My mystery man in the cap believed that the right to use the Norton name had been secured by Mr Crighton which, no doubt, wouldnt have come 'cheap'. Solid finance has to be the first hurdle to get over, i would love to know where the money is coming from.\rI must confess im well behind the times and hadnt even heard of the 600 four stroke 250 replacement class. I had expressed my doubts to the mystery man in the cap about the Norton ever being competitive in Moto GP but in a 600 class it could be right up there (IF the FIM would accept it which seems kinda unlikely).

[Steve Gee]

Just seen MCN website and the headline for next week is the rebirth of Norton. I`m hoping it`s been quiet for the last month or two because the new owners have been busy cracking on with the job rather than spreading rumours, I seem to remember thats how the new Triumph started out and it hasn`t done them any harm.

[Richard Negus]

I see from the MCN web site feature that they quote that the NRV588 road bike will come after the 961 Commando is in production. Disappointment all round for rotary enthusiasts then !

[Derek Nicol]

I see from the MCN web site feature that they quote that the NRV588 road bike will come after the 961 Commando is in production. Disappointment all round for rotary enthusiasts then !

\rPersonally i think that is great news!! the viability of a new company only producing rotary bikes had to be questionable but with the Commando the business may well be sustainable.\rMuch mocery and scorn seems to be being poured on the timescales for getting things up and running... does it really matter? as long as they have enough money to cope with any delays then i dont see it as all that important. \rI thought that Kenny Dreer resurrecting Norton with the 961 in the USA would have been good but even better is the prospect of the 961 being produced in the UK and the icing on the cake, the prospect of race and road Rotaries as well !!! \rI can understand healthy scepticism but some people seem to be almost willing the new Norton company to fail.