boyer ignition

[commando-rotary]

boyer ignition box and pickup off commander for sale would also suit interplod i would imagine no sensible offer refused. better to help someone than sit in my shed.D G

[mickm]

s it any good for a Classic?

[Richard Negus]

Mick,The internals are the same, but the Commander box has different (longer, fortunately) cables and the wires are grouped into the connectors differently.A minor hindrance, and easily overcome.The Classic rev limiter should operate at 8,750 whereas the Commander should be at 9,750. Bonus!I say 'should' because often it doesn't work but no-one goes that far up normally .When changing any Boyer box, you'll often find that it doesn't work straight away; just change over the trigger connections.R.

[Dell Boy]

I had a Boyer that was a good few years old, about 10 I think, & the limiter started coming in lower & lower down the rev range until it wouldn`t go above 4,000.Went to Maidstone to Boyers who tested it, found it defective & gave me a new one!!I`ve always stuck with the Boyer box but have it mounted in the area in the top fairing.They told me at Boyers that Shenstone omitted to tell them that the unit was going to be piggy back mounted on the hot voltage regulator & mounted above the hottest area in the fairing.This caused the units to fail due to being overheated from exterior sources.Derek F.

[mickm]

Thanks for that Richard. But do I spend out on a digital or save and use the Boyer on offer? For some reason I seem to always be changing ignition systems on my bikes!! Mick

[Richard Negus]

Spend on a digital! Fit and forget.With an old Boyer, it's almost always a case of 'when' it will start to fail, not 'if'.It's a good idea to replace the old Lucas ballast resistor with a modern version too.R.

[mickm]

Thanks Richard.The balast is one that I have had go down on me before. I'll order the ignition asap. One other thing is the front brakes have a shudder. Do you know of any available? Ta Mick

[Richard Negus]

I presume your Classic has Spondon stainless discs, identifiable by round holes cast in the centre aluminium carrier? Andover Norton may have some arm-'n-a-leg replacements left under part number 44-0116 and I recall seeing that AJS Motorcycles were offering new discs only (without any carrier) on eBay. However, I'm not confident they will fit your carrier as there were three or four different types of disc fitted at one time or another to air-cooled bikes.R.

[mickm]

Hi Richard. I'm not sure what discs they are I'll check latter and then see if I can find a spare. Thanks. Mick

[Wayne]

spondon still make the race disks fron the 80's-90's, worth a call you never know what he can do, best between 9.30 and 3.00 ask for stuart, for get emailing them

[mickm]

I rang Spondon yesterday, no joy. He was amused when I asked if they were still covered by warranty!!

[johnbirchjar]

Hi Mick,Not sure that I fully agree with Richard on "go digital,fit and forget" Iv'e just had an Ign; box pack up on me with no warning after about 36,500 miles,(This was a replacment for the original Boyer that packed up after only 14,000 miles) I suspect the VCR is faulty also after a little over 33,000 miles,(also a replacment for the original Boyer,which had lasted a little longer,17,500 miles) unfortunatly other options are rather limited unless someone knows differant? Sorry if I sound a bit miffed,but in this day and age one expects modern electronics to last indeffinatly,as they do on cars trucks & buses.When was the last time any of us had a problem with the electricery on their car?anyway,ride safe,J.B.

[johnbirchjar]

Hi DG,I'm in the market for an Ign; pickup box,and one can never have to many pickup triggers (I'm on my third in 50,000 miles)phone me on 01268 753362 tomorrow morning(Thurs) befor 11-00hrs or after 15-00hrs(I'm playing golf) ride safe,J.B.

[Richard Negus]

Hi Mick,Not sure that I fully agree with Richard on "go digital,fit and forget" Iv'e just had an Ign; box pack up on me with no warning after about 36,500 miles,(This was a replacment for the original Boyer that packed up after only 14,000 miles) I suspect the VCR is faulty also after a little over 33,000 miles,(also a replacment for the original Boyer,which had lasted a little longer,17,500 miles) unfortunatly other options are rather limited unless someone knows differant? Sorry if I sound a bit miffed,but in this day and age one expects modern electronics to last indeffinatly,as they do on cars trucks & buses.When was the last time any of us had a problem with the electricery on their car?anyway,ride safe,J.B.

John,These aren't 'modern electronics' by any stretch of the imagination. The design of our rotary ignition and Powerbox regulator is now 25 years old and they were manufactured by Ernie Bransden and his team as a cottage industry, just like Norton made the rotaries. No giant factory, no automation, no R&D Centres, just low volume, low budget, and little or no profit.If you really want something with 99% reliability, buy mainstream Japanese.R.

[johnbirchjar]

Thats told me then!! Buy Japanes? is that the bikes or just the electrics?well the alternator sounds Japanes,(Kokusan,) Masda are Japanes,they make a two cylinder rotary,could their digital ignition power box & VCR be converted to work on our Nortons,?and did I not read somewhere that the manufacturers of the rotary engine for light aircraft recieve their "Cirtificate of Airworthness" sometime last year?so electrics that are 100% reliable for rotaries are avaliable(at a price I expect) food for thought for some electronic expert in the club? Thanks for the info' re; Julian Richard,I phoned Graham,spoke to Adam? send ign; box & VCR to him and he would see what he could do,in the meantime I hope to purchase the Ign;trigger & box from of the forum so I can get the Classic back on the road,ride safe,J.B.

[johnbirchjar]

Continuing on,Re; Del Boys comment on "locating the Ign;Trigger Box in a hot spot" may be the answer as to why I've had so much trouble over the years,now I have the Sprint fairing on the bike maybe I can relocate the Ign; box somewhere nice and .Will the respective "juices" travel the extra distance?anybody know? ride safe,J.B.

[johnbirchjar]

Please phone D.G.as I am desperate for your trigger & box.J.B.

[mickm]

Hi jb when I had the Commander I always carried a spair ignition unit with me I even let it go when I sold it ask Tim .That bike did over 60000 miles mainly in europe. The next bike carried a spair as do most of my other bikes its just a fact of life our ignitio n systems are suspect

[johnbirchjar]

Hi mickm,me to,the spare one was put on the bike,and silly me,I didn't get another spare,lesson learnt.In the same them,re;"hot spot". looking at the Classic and the location of the said VCR & Ign; Box,there is no (or very little) room for air circulation,and what air there is will be a tad warm as it flows directly back from the engine,can I pick your brain Richard?where the "boxes" are situated tight up to the oil tank is a sort of mini mud flap made of a plasticky/ rubber material(very technical)hang on!! I'm getting deja vu here,have we spoke about this componant before?!! anyway, can it be removed,or drilled to aid ventalation? (I think it must be to stop road muck splashing up over the electrics hidden behind the side panel) but the panel has a flange that do's the same thing so will it be OK to remove the "mud flap"? Chuntering on("Wake up at the back there")would a "none heat conducting meterial" sandwiched between the VCR & Ign;Box help keep the Ign; Box cooler?I was thinking "kitchen foil",what started this train of thought was lifting the roasting tin out of the oven last night,tin well hot,kitchen foil covering the roast, not hot, food for thought?(oops, pardon the pun)ride safe,J.B.

[Richard Negus]

John,The flap was put there to stop dirt thrown up by the rear wheel getting onto the elctrics in that area, particularly the multipin connector to the rear lights. The Classic doesn't have that connector and, also, doesn't seem to suffer accumulated dirt there. Also, the Commander doesn't have the flap, but does have its second battery as a shield. Leave it off and see what happens; nothing, I suspect.The ignition unit and voltage regulator do not actually touch on a Classic, so there is the chance for an air flow between them.Whilst many Commanders and F1s had heat-induced ignition faults, I don't recall any such problems on the Classics and certainly never made extension looms to put the box somewhere else. Commander and F1 is a different story though - made an F1 extension harness only yesterday.R.

[johnbirchjar]

Richard,I don't know of another Classic that has clocked up as many miles as mine,so perhaps the problem has not reared its ugly head. Having said that, had an e-mail from a Classic owner in "Kiwi Land"(No84)and he has done all sorts of high milage (800 miles in one day!! in America) said he has never had this electricary problem, perhaps I am just unlucky,Hope to hear from the Startright camp today.ride safe,J.B.

[commando-rotary]

On it's way John. D G