Ex-Police Commander

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MikeBristol
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Ex-Police Commander

Post by MikeBristol » Sat Oct 26, 2019 10:43 am

Another one on eBay, coming out from a long hibernation!

item number: 274066532082

BlackIP2
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by BlackIP2 » Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:30 pm

Something not quite right with this one being billed as ex-police? No reflective tape anywhere for a start.
Might be another TRRL bike - look at those huge leg guards on the fairing. Can't ever remember seeing those on any production Commander?

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Richard Negus
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by Richard Negus » Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:26 pm

As you suggest, never a police bike. Originally a Norton demonstrator and then sold to TRRL (now TRL) and became a 'leg protector' demonstrator.
It has a tubular structure inside the fairings to support the tin boxes that were supposed to deform in an accident, requiring much modification to the plumbing and electrics to get it all in.
I rode it once and found the soft padded cushions on the outside of the fairing to be very restrictive of knee movement.
I'm sure I've seen a recent photo showing the butchered side of the fairing removed to show the framework and tin box. Was it Bonhams Stafford a few weeks ago?

I guess many of us have seen the TRRL video, firstly showing how the dummy rider on a standard Commander lost a leg in a glancing blow to a barrier and would have died of blood loss, and then another run showing how the leg protector saved his leg from serious damage - but he was catapulted forward off the bike and 'died' of a broken neck.

Nonetheless, it was very profitable business for Norton, building and re-building crash bikes for TRRL, but beware of any IP2/Commander parts for sale which are painted matt yellow.
Slower slower, no faster faster - the joys of old fogey mode to hooligan mode at the flick of a switch

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Richard Negus
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by Richard Negus » Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:05 pm

Yup, thought so!
Sold at Bonhams Stafford for £1,150. Photos show it with the side removed and black/yellow tape on the 'leg protector' bits.
Slower slower, no faster faster - the joys of old fogey mode to hooligan mode at the flick of a switch

MikeBristol
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by MikeBristol » Sat Nov 09, 2019 10:52 am

It didn't sell last time and is on the bay again. I contacted the seller, who says it has TRRL connection but also used by police - at least, has police sign at rear and lights in the fairing (which can be seen in the pictures). Mike

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Richard Negus
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by Richard Negus » Sat Nov 09, 2019 1:55 pm

I wish I had a better memory!
This bike, #4230, passed final inspection at Shenstone on 30th November 1989 and, according to my records, was a twin seat Commander. As I don't have a copy of the sales records, I don't know to whom it was sold, nor whether it was still a twin seat when sold.
It was first registered at Reading in March 1991 and carries the number H832 GRX. According to DVLA records, it was registered oddly enough as a 'Norton Villiers Triumph'.
Transport Road Research Laboratory, now just TRL, were at Crowthorne, some 10 miles from Reading. I'd suggest it was very probable that TRRL, or a nominee, were the first registered keepers of the bike.
To the best of my knowledge, all Commander police patrol bikes were delivered 'ready to go' fully equipped with blue lights, siren, "Police Stop" rear sign, radio mounts, etc. Some were registered by the factory, or usually registered by the force immediately on receipt and fitting of the Home Office radio equipment. I don't see anything about this bike to suggest it was ever kitted out as a police patrol bike.
Having said all that, and to coin a phrase, "it is what it is" and should be treated as such.
Slower slower, no faster faster - the joys of old fogey mode to hooligan mode at the flick of a switch

GeoffD
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by GeoffD » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:24 pm

Is this the bike which can be briefly seen in the background in the episode of Junk & disorderly shown yesterday (Monday 11/11)? When our two friends were looking round the London Motorcycle Museum
The yellow striped tape on the RH leg shield can clearly be seen.
The London Motorcycle Museum, was said to be in the process of being closed down - with some bikes going to Bonham's for auction.

cdrkeith
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by cdrkeith » Wed Nov 13, 2019 10:15 am

Indeed it is.....I don't watch 'Junk & Disorderly' (nice title) but 'our friends' were at also Bonhams auction at Stafford, being filmed. I didn't stay long enough to see what they bid on.

The bike in question went for £1150 inc premium. Nice little earner, if it sells.

https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/25384/#/!

James
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by James » Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:19 pm


johnbirchjar
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by johnbirchjar » Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:50 pm

Fifteen grand exclaim(even in US dollars)is a bit optimistic me thinks wink.J.B.

holger999
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by holger999 » Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:15 am

Hello,

I think the price is absolutely ok.

With this history and in its complete condition as a police bike, it is completely appropriate in my opinion.

From my point of view, I often don't understand the price discussions here in the forum.

The Norton Rotar motorcycles are beautiful, technically high-quality vehicles in particularly small numbers.

Take a close look at the exotic market:
a Münch Mammuth has a car engine. Even if the motorcycle was something special at the time of production ... but 50,000 euros plus ... I don't think it's worth it. Prices for MV Agusta are also utopian ... but all these sums are paid.

A Norton F1 Sport in very good condition, technically and optically, should cost at least 40,000 euros. In some auctions they are paid for.

So why devalue the prices of our great Norton Rotary? If the price is too high for someone, you don't have to buy it yourself.
So please think about what is partially written here. Also read by market observers.

greeting
Holger

holger999
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by holger999 » Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:35 am

holger999 wrote:
Tue Dec 31, 2019 9:15 am
Hello,

I think the price is absolutely ok.

With this history and in its complete condition as a police bike, it is completely appropriate in my opinion.

From my point of view, I often don't understand the price discussions here in the forum.

The Norton Rotary motorcycles are beautiful, technically high-quality vehicles in particularly small numbers.

Take a close look at the exotic market:
a Münch Mammuth has a car engine. Even if the motorcycle was something special at the time of production ... but 50,000 euros plus ... I don't think it's worth it. Prices for MV Agusta are also utopian ... but all these sums are paid.

A Norton F1 Sport in very good condition, technically and optically, should cost at least 40,000 euros. In some auctions they are paid for.

So why devalue the prices of our great Norton Rotary? If the price is too high for someone, you don't have to buy it yourself.
So please think about what is partially written here. Also read by market observers.

greeting
Holger

James
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by James » Tue Dec 31, 2019 5:50 pm

johnbirchjar wrote:
Mon Dec 30, 2019 11:50 pm
Fifteen grand exclaim(even in US dollars)is a bit optimistic me thinks wink.J.B.
I have been wanting a rotary for some time and finding one in the states is very difficult . However since I found there were Supremes made, I have upped my want . The police bike on eBay here, does not have a full 17 digit number that also causes problems with registration. I think you are correct, I was thinking I could find one for less. Would it need to be Molly'd?

johnbirchjar
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by johnbirchjar » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:14 am

Would it need to be Mollied? That's the $64,000 question,the short answer is "It's anybody's guess" (unless you have a detailed history of the bike)and How much experience have you had with Rotories?
There are a few basic tests one can carry out to roughly test the condition of the engine but none of them are (to my knowledge) proof of Mollying.Over to anybody with a full proof method (appart from dismantling the engine wink)
Happy hunting Very Happy,J.B.

johnbirchjar
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by johnbirchjar » Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:35 am

In reply to Holgas comments
The downside is we appeal to VEREY small market (and that market is getting older and smaller with each passing year.)
Most bikers under the age of 50 have never even heard of a Rotory(of any make) let alone wish to own one exclaim.
Those of us that own and ride these machines can extol their virtues "Till the Cows Come Home" but if it is any indication, the majority of my biker buddies have no wish to own one,and tend to stick with whatever piston-driven machines they have always ridden,hence the realistic(mostly)prices asked.J.B.

holger999
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by holger999 » Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:56 pm

Sorry, but your answer is incorrect ...
because with a Münch Mammuth, just to give one example,
it is nothing else.
Even smaller quantities ... and it was built long before a rotary.
With MV Augusta it is no different ...

I think rather ... that the forum is only looking for bargains ...
the appreciation of the long test phase and the production and the great readiness for series production ... see also Isle Of Man Steve Hislop and others just missed out!

We should think about that.

greeting
Holger

James
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by James » Fri Jan 10, 2020 5:04 am


johnbirchjar
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Re: Ex-Police Commander

Post by johnbirchjar » Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:18 am

Very nice,but "Yours Truly" would not pay $15.000 for it(that's about twelve grand in Stirling)but seeing as Rotories are a bit thin on the ground out in the US of A,perhaps one of our American cousins would think it not to steep wink.
What say you Florida Mike?(hope you are keeping well,you havn't been on the forum for some considerable time)J.B.

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